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"So we're back to Pavlov and Skinner. Kids do know about their frineds. The term "psychopath" was in academic use by the early 1910s, and the definitive work on psychopathy was published in 1941. Was Tom there for him when he needed him? The most undereducated, illiterate, ridiculous people become teachers. If someone read my journals as a teen, youd assume my Mom and I would have killed each other by now, but now we are pretty close. If that;s the case, why did he have so many friends? We've never left. You're far too stupid to ever see that though. "Susan said, came when somebody said, "I forgive you for what you've done." In them, its obvious to see how his anger and rage turned from being directed toward himself to directed toward others. Don't believe me? Children learn psychopathy from their parents (e.g., the Bushes). Sue (as both she and her son share the same surname, Im going to refer to them by their first names for the sake of clarity) begins by emphasizing that she and her husband, Tom, truly had no idea what Dylan was planning. Dylan Klebold was 17 when he and Harris,18, carried out their long-planned attack on the high school about 13 miles south of downtown Denver. I want you to have that fly CD. I havent done anything for which I need forgiveness, Susan Klebold said. They do not have a moral center that can be reached. Eric Harris was quite the hottie, I don't understand why he had to go and kill himself. They always have, and unless we can change it (which might be very "Pandora") they always will. Let's set aside the pipe bomb issue and Eric's scrapes with the law for a moment and ask why they weren't more involved with their kid. As a reporter scribbled, Hooker reconsidered. Dylan adds that they can have his things as well. "He said, 'One of the boys my son shot said Dylan was a nice kid,' " Berg says. Spelling aside, Eric Harris had turned 18 about a week prior. . Oprah asked the teachers to describe Harris/Klebold, the teachers talked about how they didn't fit in, wore trenchcoats, seemed troubled and dangerous, and so on. February 12, 2016 11:56am. I'm glad Oprah isn't going to help this man promote his book. A Mothers Reckoning: Living in the Aftermath of Tragedy. Maybe he needs to go home. His parents were Wayne and Katherine. It is actually a lot of conformist bunk to serve the status quo. I think that even I have sustained some slight rewiring from that, though not anywhere *near* to the extent of my brother's. By. . Dylan was giddy and beaming, all cleaned up for once. The goal seems to have been parental appeasement. Sue suggests that for someone as sensitive to humiliation and loss of control as Dylan, these types of events may have made a big influence on him, and created a bond between the boys. For a couple reasons. [quote]He has always been excessively cruel to animals (he even shot and killed his own dog because it barked), obsessed with weapons, "charmingly" manipulative of adults, a pathological liar, disdainful of other people and abusive to them and VERY quick to anger. It just seems all a bit odd. For happy, easy-to-raise, and successful kids like him, it was easy to fly under their parents radar precisely because they were the shiny pennies, hiding the terrible pain they were in from their parents as capably as they did everything else (p. 65). He was kind, gentle, smart, and happy. Dylan Klebold. The prom was the standard affair. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. Sunday, April 25, 1999; Page A8. Great job! When early word came that the Trench Coat Mafia may be involved in the shooting, Tom ran downstairs to look for Dylans trench coat, which he couldnt find, Lozow said. He was a sociopath and needed drugs and a really good psychiatrist. I worked as a dishwasher, then busboy then waiter in a German-American restaurant years ago when I was growing up. As a . Eric Harris was beyond needing a therapist. No matter how angry they were they wouldn't be able to kill that many without those weapons. Eric's dad answered a phone call from Green Mountain Guns. (p. 277). But she focuses greatly on the lead-up to that day, hoping to shed light on what happened to her son in order to help someone else see signs in their own child while they still have a chance to intervene. It didn't help matters any that our father was an abusive asshole. Hey mom, gotta go Tom isnt even included in the insincere goodbye. Second, the reason no one at the school noticed is because no one is ever trained to notice. Klebold, S. (2016). On April 20, 1999, Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold stormed into Columbine High School in Littleton, Colorado and murdered 13 people before killing themselves. Sue and her husband were vehemently opposed, but Dylan still asked for a gun for Christmas his final year. LITTLETON, Colo. Just 15 people attended the funeral of Columbine High School killer Dylan Klebold on Saturday two ministers, eleven mourners and two anguished parents wondering where they'd gone . Tom is a geophysicist, Sue works with handicapped people. The Klebolds attorney, Gary Lozow, told The Denver Post the Klebolds had no plans to grant any other interviews. Virginia Tech. "However, there is credible, tangible, measurable, and repeatable evidence that there are some people, for whatever reason, have their brains wired differently.". Or it's everything. Brian Rohrbough, father of victim Daniel Rohrbough, said he was outraged that the Klebolds likened the day of the shootings to a natural disaster in the interview with Brooks. I've linked an article from Nature magazine about it. Subject: Re: Dylan's house google earth Tue May 10, 2016 10:18 pm. multiple newspapers and media outlets in the days after reported dylan and his father having the kind of relationship where, when dylan would come home from school, they would share a snack and read the sports section of the newspaper together. So I'm gone. No one could control him. . He was afraid Dylan might be involved. By the time of the shooting, facing his intense feelings of alienation, she says his journals show the only emotions Dylan could connect to were anger and hopelessness. Now everybody expects the schools to fix everything for them. Am I supposed to be impressed by dates, VOTN? Dylan (Klebold) did not do this because of the way he was raised, Susan Klebold told columnist David Brooks in Saturdays editions of The New York Times. When asked about Dylan's behavior, Byron indicated that Dylan appeared to be somewhat detached and he went on to explain that as a "pissed off teenager." Byron went on to state that Dylan gave no indication to believe that something like this was going to occur. My own experience is that my gifted teacher dragged me out of sporting events because they weren't academic enough, encouraged my teachers to assign me extra work that the other kids didn't do, and basically didn't understand teenagers, high school, or what it was like to be ostracized at all. He went to his senior prom and based on his journal had a wonderful time, and was invested in his future to such an extent that he chose a college and made a trip out to Arizona to look at dorm rooms with his father. Growing up in Ohio, she had a mixed religious upbringing with her Christian mother and Jewish father. . He was one of the teens behind the Columbine High School Massacre in 1999. The second of the Columbine killers, Dylan Klebold was a "born genius" who, despite a sensitive disposition, experienced explosions of rage (most often brought on by failure or humiliation,) suicidal tendencies, a disdain for the "zombie"-like human race, and a suggestibility upon which the psychopathic . It's about a half an hour before our little judgment day. Or is your tiny mind only capable of two viewpoints? Dylan kept talking about college, about his future. (talks about his mother being thoughtful, bringing him candy and Slim Jims) "I really am sorry about all this. The problem, Cullen concludes, was that there is almost nothing that can be done to help psychopaths. Or if they are, it's not because they're running amok in the store. ". People that want to pretend that the parents were just innocent distant bystanders who had no responsibility for anything that happened are repulsive. I had to fight for their basic rights because allegedly educated teachers thought things like "retards are dangerous" and "retards should be kept away from the good kids". FULL DOCO - PT 2 OF 3, 2. They could still have been on the outskirts of the school. I think it's really odd that Tom Said Dylan was His best friend and Dylan Kind of didn't seem to care at all about his dadso one of them Had a really wrong perception. In my defense, R78, everyone knew I wrote the best hand. The deadliest school shooting in the United States was the Virginia Tech massacre, with 33 fatalities and 23 injuries. They had heard the gunmen may have been part of the Trench Coat Mafia, a loose group of students, including their son, who said athletes at Columbine bullied them. He and his partner Dylan Klebold were responsible for the Columbine High School massacre (1999). One young doctor said, "I don't know if you can teach compassion, but you surely can teach the opposite! Ericx92s parents knew their son was no angel x97 he broke into a van, he was found making pipe bombs and setting them off for fun x97 and they took steps to address this. I'm sorry, all right. Planning? As Dylan entered adolescence, he became a bit more complicated. He has always been excessively cruel to animals (he even shot and killed his own dog because it barked), obsessed with weapons, "charmingly" manipulative of adults, a pathological liar, disdainful of other people and abusive to them and VERY quick to anger. Posted 3 years ago ", Eric: (eventually) "That's it. . I think he suffered horribly before he died, Susan Klebold said. Dylan Bennett Klebold. Klebold attended the high . Based on the end of Cullen's book, who was of course supposed to be a guest, most of them have moved on. . I wish the Harris and Klebold parents were rotting in prison right now as a lesson to parents that wash their hands of it and say "not my problem. I'd add that Tom watched the basement tapes and even after seeing them first-hand, stated something to the effect of 'see he didn't want to do it' (I'm paraphrasing here). As we ourselves have often concluded in class, it seems Sue also came to the understanding that the massacre was the culmination of a number of different factors for Dylan, none of which on their own would have created such an act. A few weeks ago, I reviewed Sue Klebold's memoir A Mother's Reckoning: Living in the Aftermath of Tragedy, about her experience as the mother of Dylan Klebold, one of the Columbine High School shooters.While I was able to share the manner by which she communicated her ideas and insights, I wasn't able to . Here's what you need to know: 1. Teachers have no training in mental disorders or warning signs. How often did they fix things up, was he emotionally available for Dylan? Her son's name became famous when in 1999 he became one of two direct perpetrators of the deadliest high school shooting in U.S. history. They often have an interest in guns and weapons, with easy access to firearms, and have often repeatedly made clear their violent intentions to others (usually peers). In the days after Dylan Klebold along with Eric Harris shot and killed 12 students and one teacher and then himself at Columbine High School on April 20, 1999, his mother, Sue Klebold, remembered . Dylan was also drinking at the end of his life, likely complicating his mental health issues, though had once said that marijuana was a waste of time and so perhaps wasnt involved in drugs. So they actually DO blame the kids for setting off their little angels on a murderous rampage. "Psychopaths don't feel guilty because they are blind to guilt," Ochberg said. I believe it was either a sibling or playmates. Sue had no idea it was a life-and-death situation. Some folks do indeed work from very primitive brain impulses. Thats Something that stands out about Dylan anyway, the Lack of Emotion regarding his parents. The mother of Columbine killer Dylan Klebold says she thinks every day about the people her . Then Oprah asked if they ever reached out to them or spoke to their parents - not one of them had done a thing. [quote]The teachers at Columbine all seemed incredibly disengaged. Oprah asked the teachers to describe Harris/Klebold, the teachers talked about how they didn't fit in, wore trenchcoats, seemed troubled and dangerous, and so on. I was in high school at the time. They have grown up to be (somewhat) upstanding members of society, but I don't see how it is so easy to go from knowing your kid is making crank calls and setting off amateur pipe bombs to seeing him as a psychopathic murderer. He had been in a gifted child program, and you'd think they'd have some type of monitoring since kids who are that advanced frequently have problems. I can't remember. Christ R22/R32/R39 et all. Isaiah's father said. You're a judgmental twat, r14. I'm just thinking of the argument Sue mentioned in her book where Tom was insisting that Dylan remove his baseball hat before they went for breakfast (during their visit to Arizona State University). Apologies in advance if this question has already been answered. Both were from Columbus, Ohio and went to Ohio State University. She behaves as if it is normal, as if she doesn't even hear it. Very well said, r18. . Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris opened fire at the suburban Denver school on April 20, 1999, killing 13 people before taking their own lives. How do you teach someone to have emotions or empathy? No scientist knows this absolutely. I think you did an excellent job with this blog post. Klebold and Harris were in a juvenile diversion program for breaking into a van and stealing tools and other items in January 1998. It didn't seem to slow down the ordinary media train. They acknowledged they missed signs that their son was in trouble. By his junior and senior years, Dylans parents knew something was wrong. He's wearing black BDUs (military-style pants) tucked into military-style boots. When the clerk told him "Hey, your clips are in." "In my opinion, what went on in their home led to Columbine.". The two would . Here, let me get your coats for you. [quote]He had been in a gifted child program, and you'd think they'd have some type of monitoring since kids who are that advanced frequently have problems. But she came to realize the truth was far more troubling. Well, Mrs. Klebold is quite the victim, isn't she? Dylan says people will note the date and time when watching it. Eric's also wearing a plaid shirt that's either dark blue or black with white, with a white t-shirt on underneath. VOTN needs to get a clue. The couple said they felt under siege after the shooting and never had a chance to grieve for their son. Do you think Dylans dad could embarrass him as a child in front of other people or humiliate him in other ways that could result in Dylans low self esteem or was Dylan naturally shy? Sorry if I can't be interested in something without arousing your ire. Asking how instead of why allows us to frame the descent into self-destructive behavior as the process that it is. Dylan seems to have been a very unhappy person. It would be satisfying to blame the parents. He still was the boy his parents joked seemed to be on autopilot (p. 65), but Sue notes that this may have been particularly dangerous in his case. The half-Jewish Dylan Klebold is more of a cipher. There are a lot more R&V followers out there than you would think. I honestly do believe (and so does mom) that his brain has been rewired primarily by a head injury he sustained when he was just toddling. She hyped it up as a must see and an insight to what really happened. i think he was also quoted saying that he had lost his best friend. His parents were both born in Colorado but while he was working in the Air Force as a transport pilot, Wayne Harris held 11 . Andreas Lubitz, Adam Lanza, Dylan Klebold and Anders Breivik (from left to right) On the second . Join date : 2014-02-11. Dylan Klebold Character Analysis. But a new book, x93Columbine,x94 by Dave Cullen, reviews every bit of evidence about the shooting short of the parentsx92 firsthand accounts x97 25,000 pages of documents, including videotapes and journals of the killers x97 all of which point to the same chilling conclusion as the Carneal depositions: it is entirely possible for x93goodx94 parents to raise a murderer. They opened fire on students and teachers at Columbine High School in Columbine, Colorado, on the Nazi leader's birthday in 1999, killing 12 classmates and a teacher and wounding 23 people before taking their own lives. Eric was born in Wichita, Kansas. People need to understand this could have happened to them, he said. Harris and Klebold met at Ken Caryl Middle School during their seventh grade year. Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold are once more in the family room of the Harris home. The big trifecta of psychopathology. Are any of Robert Hare's books of interest, if you know? He's wearing a plaid shirt, either dark blue or black with white; the shirt's untucked. Eric Harris, 18, and Dylan Klebold, 17, walked into Columbine High School with shotguns, automatic weapons, and homemade pipe . Yaron Steinbuch. Dylan's mother, Sue Klebold, confirmed to radio host Terry Gross on "Fresh Air" Tuesday that she is Jewish, and her now ex-husband, Dylan Klebold's father, is Lutheran, and said her son . His parents didnt yet know to monitor his internet usage. Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold was the deadliest high school shooting in U.S. history, . Firstly, like everyone else he didnt pick up on his mental health nor was Dylan apparently showing it to his best friend. I do find it odd that youd characterise your 17 year old son as your best friend anyway, youre his father. (The OP was looking for books on personality mirroring and other techniques sociopaths use). A lot of psychiatry is and has always been about cheap quick labels, rather than an honest analysis of the society in which individuals live. Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold were charged with theft, criminal mischief, and criminal trespassing for breaking into a van and . Bull fucking shit. Who is "limiting" the discussion to the brain? Dylan was remembered as a Cub Scout who attended church with his family. Sue Klebold. Those kids were their responsibility legally. A Further Examination: Sue Klebolds case study of her son, Dylan Klebold, Trauma and Suicide within Law Enforcement, Mental Health and Mass Murders: The Connection between Trauma and School Shootings, Mental Health Treatment in Correctional Facilities, Forensic Behavior Analysis: Self Care in the CJ Field, Trauma in Female Juvenile Inmates and Delinquents. Dylan Klebold's mother: 'I felt I was a good mom'. Brian Rohrbough, father of victim Daniel Rohrbough, said he was outraged that the Klebolds . -- b. I just wanted to apologize to you guys for any crap this might instigate as far as (inaudible) or something. Harris' family eventually settled in Colorado in 1992. Sorry. I don't believe I've said anything about gun control, of which this country has far too little of. Just three days before the shooting, he went to prom with a friend. OSHKOSH, Wis. (WBAY) - A special event was held in Oshkosh Tuesday afternoon, where the mother Dylan Klebold, one of the two gunmen responsible for the Columbine High School shootings in Colorado . He didn't even say hi to Tom or ask how he was. COLUMBINE HIGH SCHOOL massacre - WikiVidi Documentary. We will just do the opposite and everyone will be safe. His father, who had been in the military, was strict with Eric, and actions in that house had consequences. Brookscolumn did not say when and where the interview took place. Betty Shoels, Isaiah's aunt, said that "her 18-year-old nephew was a fun-loving athlete who was always smiling, despite feeling out of place as one of the school's few African-American students." . Tom seemed in complete denial. I'm sure they still live in Columbine and are active in many community functions, especially the PTA. What happened to them? The perpetrator often has faced peer or social rejection, endured bullying, has anger about the bullying, and lacks the social or coping skills to deal with these issues. He lays bare the callous brutality of mastermind Eric Harris and the quavering, suicidal Dylan Klebold, who went to the prom three days earlier and obsessed about love in his journal. Ten years after the Columbine killings, the Harris family has not spoken publicly at all, and the Klebold parents have given one interview, to the columnist David Brooks here at the New York Times. Eric's parents were both born in Colorado but while his father Wayne Harris was working in the Air Force as a transport pilot, Wayne held 11 different positions at six different bases in Ohio . I still think it's easy to place blame on the parents within the context of what happened, but tons of kids are little miscreant assholes who commit petty shit like Eric & Dylan were doing. Harris was born in Wichita, Kansas, on April 9, 1981. His father was a geophysicist and a mother worked with the disabled . Too bad. Press J to jump to the feed. While in class we have made abundantly clear that most people with mental health issues are non-violent, Dylans depression and suicidality fits the school shooter pattern. It's getting late; Eric looks at his watch and says it's 1:28 AM on March 15. In a video-diary-style recording, Dylan stated his parents had been good to him. Sue Klebold decided to speak up now because she wants to tell other parents the signs she missed and what she would do differently. I think it is really interesting to think about the many things that lead someone to commit a school shooting. His mom was trying to find the best fit for him, but I suspect it ended up being more difficult for him), and both enjoyed violent video games. Ordinary, normal people who genuinely loved their son. Nothing taken care of that I needed him to do (like take care of the cats). Neither seemed to know where or with whom he was most of the time. The Klebolds stayed, at least as of 2004. Eric David Harris (April 9, 1981 - April 20, 1999) and Dylan Bennet Klebold (/ . Though posthumous diagnosis isnt possible, that Dylan was seriously depressed is not up for debate (p. 160), and his behaviors might have also fit the criteria for other diagnoses such as avoidant personality disorder, schizotypal personality disorder, and/or borderline personality disorder. I seem to remember them being called "fag.". KleboldI started reading the Columbine book, how does he try to explain Klebold? . You can criticize psychiatry without being a Scientologist. The parents of Eric Harris, 18, and Dylan Klebold, 17, remained in seclusion Wednesday as a global media horde encamped at their houses after the murderous rampage Tuesday at Columbine High School. Attacks seem planned in advance, with the shooter expecting to be killed or planning to commit suicide in conjunction with the attack. of course, tom has never come out and publicly spoken the way sue has; from my personal observation he seems to be a little more torn up about it than she. And psychiatrists, rather dubious "doctors" push drugs. Not only would that give us someone to blame (someone still living, unlike Eric and Dylan, who turned their guns on themselves), but it would also allow the psychic distance between x93usx94 and x93themx94 that frightened humans crave. Brian Rohrbough, father of victim Daniel Rohrbough, said he was outraged that the Klebolds likened the day of the shootings to a natural disaster in the interview with Brooks. Attention was paid. Dylan wrote an essay about a school shooting that disturbed his teacher enough that it was referred to the school counselor. Wayne & Kathy Harris are the parents of infamous Columbine HS shooter, Eric Harris. Not only had Dylan experienced bullying in school, his school fit some of the factors that meant it was most at risk for a shooting by ignoring certain behaviors and otherwise unevenly enforcing the rules. Bedwetting, firesetting and cruelty to animals. School shooters often show little attachment to their school. in CJ 725, Tagged: columbine, mass murderer, mental illness, school shootings. His lower half can't be seen. They then killed themselves in the school library. I cannot have my uzzer patrons being upset. Funny how things cycle.". But there isn't one thing. Theyd never seen his rage, nor ever felt scared of him. By Eun Kyung Kim. However, there is credible, tangible, measurable, and repeatable evidence that there are some people, for whatever reason, have their brains wired differently. This thread is going to hell in jig time if it turns into the all-too-familiar "they were running up and down the aisles and that caused Columbine!!!" On August 30, 2006 Columbine obsessed 18 year old Alvaro Castillo would murder his father with a sawed off Mossberg 500 shotgun at their home and then drive to a local high school and open fire. Hell, Klebold and a bunch of their friends went to the prom the weekend before the killings. As she says, The rest of the world could explain away what he had done: either he was born evil a bad seed or hed been raised without moral guidance.